Can someone explain to me why people actually think God has anything to do with adoption?

myst1998

Hi Lt,

I don't believe God has anything to do with what humans do to each other. This would negate the whole "free-will" we have and if He started interfering with one thing then where would it stop?

I personally feel God is NOT in favour of today's style of adoption... you only need to see that from the Bible so if these nutters who have been coming in here lately really knew their Bible they wouldn't be in favour of adoption. I mean seriously, the main adoption story everyone goes on about from the Bible is Moses and in the end, he turned his back on his adoptive family and went back to his real family. People will use whatever they can to get what they want in the end even if that means bending the facts to suit their agenda.

Linny G

Because people use God for their own selfish agendas.
They also interpret the Bible for their own agendas.

People who do this are usually narrow minded and uneducated.

Flying Monkey #073177

God only has a hand in adoption if you are the one praying for a child. I've never heard of a woman praying to give away her kid or a child praying to loose their entire being.

Mei-Ling

Because people need something to believe in. The thing is, they don't realize that their train of thought has consequences. When they think "I just want to be a mom and start a family so I'm going to adopt"... they don't think about how the consequences of THEM being able to have a family will effect a Chinese mother halfway across the globe suffering from the OCP.

"i'm positive that God supports it b/c it's a way for us to help those children who's mothers cared nothing for them"

I'm going to break that myth. It has nothing to do with a mother not loving her child. Sorry, but that's not how adoption works. Believe it or not believe it, but that just isn't the truth in many cases.

SJM

God has nothing to do with adoption. Freud, yes. God, no. When I was little, I remember being mad at God because Jesus' mom was young and unmarried, and he went out of his way to make sure she got to keep him, but my mother was taken from me for the same reasons. Then I got a little older and realized that religion has nothing to do with God. If there is a God, he or she cannot possibly fit into a book. God designed babies to be dependent upon their mothers even after birth. God made no provision for infant adoption. Technology did that with the invention of infant formula. Maybe people should be thanking corporations and misguided psychiatrists for their bundles of joy instead of God. I mean, give credit where credit is due.

sweetjane

Sadly, SOME people think that god wills things to happen. If that were true, it would be great....but either it doesn't happen or their deity is a complete ***. No disrespect to Mrs. Johnson, but the fact that any god would allow you to be born to a woman who was addicted to drugs, the fact that he would allow you to be nearly stomped to death by your own mother says more about your deity than I care to know. If it was 'god's will' that you be with your adoptive family, why didn't god just put you there to start with? Why did he make your adoptive mother infertile? Where was 'god's will' when you were being beaten?
Unfortunately, this belief has caused more problems in this world than I care to count. By believing that it is 'god's will' that some people suffer, that some people die prematurely, that some people will experience horiffic, debilitating deaths, it allows you to ignore and dismiss the pain of others. 9 million children under the age of 5 died THIS YEAR from starvation. Is that 'god's will'?? What about the holocaust, Darfur, Rwanda, etc? If you buy into the 'god's will' bs, then it overwhelmingly says that this is what god wants to happen....this happens to make the person 'stronger in their faith'. The Christian god did this 'fun' thing in the book of Job. He decided that Job was a good, faithful follower....but tested him anyway. God wipes out Job's entire family. Job remains faithful. God REPLACES his family with a new one. And all is happy and wonderful. THAT is what this mindset teaches you as it relates to adoption. That you can simply replace family members with new ones and that god 'wills' it to happen....conveiniently...to the benefit of the person saying it.

kateiskate

I agree with Linny G. There are people who inappropriately bring God into all kinds of situations. These are often uneducated people. Last night I was watching "17 Kids and Counting" and the parents actually said "Evolution is not scientifically based"....Seriously???

Indian-vision

LT- Everybody has a different perception of god according to their religon, culture and what they grew up understanding(taught by a priest/minister or parent).

As a Hindu, i believe in the Hinduism/Sikhism philosphy .

I don't need my religon and its philosphy mocked here on this forum where i am dead sure i will end up offending people with my scriptures and a Hindu's explanation.And i will get offended by the TD's and remarks about whats sacred to me.

If you do need to chat we can do it in private if you wish.

Corn is not dog food- I love your line " People confuse GOD for Santa Clause". Very well said.

ETA- Just confused with TD- Which part do you disagree with 1) Everybody has different beliefs 2) I am a Hindu 3) I don't want to get mocked on the forum.

MamaKate

Dear LT,

People created adoption - especially as it is today! Adoption rarely occurs in nature without death as a factor.

Does God make mistakes? Does (s)he "put babies in the wrong tummys"? Puh-lease. I suppose it is easier for some to think that God makes good things happen, but would God make good things happen the way the adoption industry works? I cannot fathom a God being that greedy, underhanded or heartless. (Don't agencies remind you of other biblical characters though? Pharocees, Lucifer,the brothers of Joseph with the coat of many colors, Judas,... )

It does kind of amaze me also, how much religion gets tied to adoption and yet I have yet to find a VALID reason why. It seems almost hypocritical to me. Second guessing nature/God. Thanking God for joy at another's expense. comparing Jesus and Moses to modern adoption, etc. just don't make sense to me. Humans do these things to one another, not God. I don't get it either.

If God had something to do with adoption, it would only happen when necessary. (I think if there were are God, it would never be necessary.)

I think people are just intelligent animals who do try to do what we can in a crazy world. Nature is a balance and humans seem to only care when the balance gets too far off. JMHO.

Anha S

I was told as a child that god had a plan for me, and that he brought me to my aparents. I think the idea of that interference is one of the biggest reasons I turned my back on christianity. To say that their god would advocate treating women and children this way just rubs me the wrong way.

kitta

Some people want to believe that God is justifying their own plans for adopting a child. But, the reality is that adoption is a government social program that also is supported by private interests and public and private money. Grant money is given to child placement agencies. Tax credits are given to adopting individuals. This has nothing to do with God.

The Creator designed the human female to conceive and carry children, and give birth to them. Having given birth myself, I find it hard to believe that God intended for newborn children to be handed over to other, unrelated people, to be raised by them. From a biological standpoint, that makes no sense, unless there is something seriously flawed in the mother, and/or her entire family.

In nature, babies who are separated from their mothers die. Survival is what it is all about.

tish_part deux

God is nothing more than a trump card for those who wish to tip the scales.

quite honestly, i doubt that God has the free time to give a sh !t about someone's baby jones, especially when we have two wars, genocides and natrual disasters going on.

Robin W

I have searched the Bible for examples and found that the ones the religious adoption agencies give are specious when the scripture is taken in context. For instance, Moses wound up living in luxury, but being nurtured by his own mother, and, in the end, rejected his adopters for his own people.

Solomon's decision was to give the baby to the real mother rather than to the woman who wanted to claim him because the real mother was willing to surrender rather than see the infant killed.

Jesus was aware of His true parentage and never tried to act otherwise.

Though the fundamentalists say they can cite chapter and verse, they are doing what they most decry which is giving their own slant to scripture...interpreting for their own purposes.

In fact, and especially in the old Testament but also in the Christmas story ("...for Joseph was of the house of David..."), blood heritage is very important and is considered an integral part of a person's identity.

It has been said that even the Devil can quote scripture for his own purposes. This painful and heart-breaking practice called infant adoption looks like a devilish thing, to me.

Carol c

I'm also of the belief that God has nothing to do with adoption. If anything, God created women with the ability procreate and carry their child within their body to birth. I don't believe for a second that any kind of higher power would intentionally have a woman become a vessel or birthing machine to provide an infertile woman with a child.

If God or any higher power has a hand in the man-made concept of adoption, he/she would make sure every mother is provided with the means and support to take care of her child.

opedial

I will try to explain my beliefs. I a member of the Metis community in Canada. I believe in balance and harmony.

I do not believe the Creator was involved in selecting my children for "me". I do not believe that my children were meant to go through their hardships that landed them in foster care. I cannot believe a God intervenes in that manner.

I do believe that we aer presented with opportunities by the Creator (God). I believe I was meant to move into a new city for a new job, to be offereed the placement of my children, and to raise them in a way that would do the Creator proud.

The children were not meant for me, and I was not meant for them, but due to obvious path choices, I have landed up in a position that I believe I am NOW meant to parent these children, who are in need of parents. I believe that my children are a blessing to us, and that we cherish that gift every day.

So i don''t believe their was ANY design in the beginning that our path was to be their parents, I would asusme if their was a path for my children it was oriignalloy to be with their parents, but that failed, and I believe a series of events lead me to parent them. They are as follows:

Eight years of infertiflity, five years waiting for a child in my hoem province.

My career flourished in that time, and I was offered a job in a different city and province.

One month into moving, we enquired about adoption. After erading our profile, skills etc. and our fostering experience, they sped us through our process, and had a match for us.

In the time the children have moved in, the caseworker said she has never seen a match bond and attach so fast. They also said they were shocked at the drastic improvement of my children's so called high needs.

While in a Sweat (spiritual ceremony) earlier this year, I could feel, from the spirit of the earth and the creator that I was meant to meet with my children's birth parent (first mother) and open the adoption a bit more, meeting annually and keeping a scrapbook for my kids and for the first mom. I didn't believe in this before, but after the Sweat I knew what I was supposed to do.

That is it really, so I don't buy that children are born to be adopted to create a family, but I do belive that God or whateve ryou call him/her, does provide opportunities in life to create harmony and restoration, such as me not having children, wanting children, and my children losing their mother, and the opportunity that brought us together.

For all of this, I believe very much that I am guided by the universe in all I di, and this played a large part in my adoption process.

sorry for the ramble and hope this made sense.

Serenity71

LT I don't go around saying to people "God decided this for you..." I won't be saying that to my kids either. My kids aren't baptized...I was baptized as an adult. I felt the choice to follow a Christian faith should be theirs not ours.

Our faith has nothing to with why we chose adoption being of Christian faith. No one in our church urged us to do it. There are single parents in our church too. And no one gets around telling single pregnant girls they can't keep their babies.
There are foster kids that come along... all sorts of people.

I don't like judgmental Christians that think they are holier than anyone else and get around with their little rule books and condemning people because they don't measure up to their ideals...And want to bend people to fit into their square. (I smile and pray for them. Someone has too...)

But that's me. I love people whether they have a faith in a god or not.

Edit; LT, regarding you last comment.

You'lll grow old trying understand some peoples motives in why they do things. Not all Christians are the same, nor all Muslims, Buddhist or Hindu's or whatever belief you follow. There are extremes in all of them, and there are ones that see things in a different light yet still have a faith. Christians are still human, and because of that they aren't perfect, and even people who don't believe in god and Jesus still aren't perfect....when you find the answer let us know.

DevonChaos

Because many people use "god" to explain things that they cannot understand, they use "god" as an excuse to say that things are "meant to be" or "his will" when things go a certain way. I obviously do not believe in "god". I think that if there was a "god", he (or she) would have much better things to do than decide the placement of babies who are up for adoption. You'd think he'd (she'd) be more concerned with the babies who had no chance to make it.

If you truly believe in "god", that's fine, but it really drives me crazy when I hear it come up in terms of adoption. I don't believe that anyone would choose for my first mother to suffer so that my adoptive parents could have a child. I don't think that a deity would muck around in something that causes so much pain in families and hearts around the world. I think if "god" truly existed, and if he were that concerned with adoption, it wouldn't be corrupt. "All loving" and "agape" and all those nice phrases...

celtic.piskie

As I usually say, If god wanted me to be left,

If god wanted me to be abandoned,

If god wanted me to have my nose, jaw, teeth, arm, fingers broken by one of HIS pastors,

Then 'god' isn't worth a prayer.

To the believers, god does everything for them, in their mind, the women deserve to loose their children., because they deserve to have them.

How anyone deserves someone else's child I'll never understand.

Bottom line, these people have a b%Â£%& for a god.

Crucio

God does not cause suffering that is caused by Man kind, God also allows free will. Mrs. Johnsonâ€™s mother choose to take drugs while with child, she also choose to try and kill her child.

I am positive that God has nothing against adoption when it is done for the right reasons. Being that the child, baby, teen truly needs a home and parent(s). God might wish that a child could stay with their natural family (as long as it is save for the child) but in this sin invested world that is not always an option.

I do think that God wanted me to be in the family I was adopted into since my Nmother was in no shape form to care for me , nor had any support from her family so staying with her was out of the question. Even more so that I was born in the south they were often very adamant that black and bi-racial or any mixed race child with black ancestry be placed with a black adoptive family. My social worker at the time even said my family had 0 chance of adopting me and that they would have to â€œkidnapâ€ me if they wanted to keep me. This never and still makes no sense to me seeing that my biological mother was a white woman.

However by the will of God I guess some could say I (a bi-racial child)was adopted by my white foster family. My mother says she and other family (Grandma, Aunt, Uncles etc) prayed daily that I would stay with them or if not that I would at least be placed in a good family.

When Christ returns he will rule the earth for 1000 years. There will no longer be need for adoption in the millennium Kingdome, people will not be infertile because everything will be perfect and the world will be at peace. People will also have long lifespans (living up to possible 1000 years) no infant will ever die shortly after birth or in the womb. The only cause of death will be old age or that the 1000 year reign has ended but that is just the time when God will create a new heaven and earth and everyone will be judged at the white throne of God. Though there will be no need for adoption all people will be family regardless if they are bio related or not, we will all be adopted children of God and adopted siblings of Jesus. You will have villages raising children.

you need to look at this way. God knows what is in our heart and knows what will happen before it does. He also gave us free will. He knows that some people will abuse children and because of free will he can't do anything about it. But he does put an idea in others minds to adopt them and be their parents. Not everyone follows those thoughts because WE HAVE FREE WILL

I do think God is involved and I think he was involved in our foster placement and pending adoption

sizesmith

Sometimes, when we are here on God's earth, we must make our own way here. What goes around, comes around.

I've been through terribly hard times in my life, losing a husband and a child after a fire a week after my 21st birthday. I've also had some wonderful, joyous times, and consider myself the luckiest, most blessed person on earth to have the world's best partner, 2 beautiful sons (one who happens to be adopted), and are hoping for more children. When I've done better, and been a better person, life gets better.

I have asked for signs from God to let me know he's there. Tonight, I was cleaning out some boxes, and found a Bible that I had received at birth with my name engraved on it. Somehow, it survived the fire that my husband and daughter didn't, and since then, it has survived another house fire. Perhaps that's a sign that God was there to protect me through all that, which he did.

My dad passed away 2 years ago today, and while I was sitting with him in the last few hours, he hadn't been able to speak. He said, "Mom's come to get me" and I never mentioned it to my sister and mom and we each told my aunt what had happened. When my adopted son was being born, I had gotten to the hospital, and a car that looked just like my dad's was parked in the spot closer to the door than me, and in my rush I heard the man say, "I've got to go see my new grandson." I turned around, and he wasn't there. the little girl we were expecting turned out to be a boy. Maybe it's my imagination, but I think there's too many people who've had experiences like that and that he was there.

In the adoption areas, Moses was left in the river to avoid being killed. He was adopted and later came to take the 10 commandments from God. Maybe God has a plan for everyone, and we just need to be the best we can to work in his world.

As a Christian, God is part of every decision. He is an important part of our lives, our culture, and our decisions. We are like clay in his hands, to mold. It's not just in the adoption factors, but every factor in life.

Sofiakat

What you are asking is a question that theology scholars have been asking for centuries. "Why do bad things happen to good people" is the question at the crux of it.
While studying theology from a non-religious university, different theories were debated back and forth and were on going for all four years.
Here were the three main theories:

God is all powerful, all knowing and can do what he wants (therefore is he just mean? Making children suffer abuse, people suffer starvation, rape, horrible deaths? Would he not at least intervene for the most innocent?)

God is all knowing, but not all powerful. (He cannot interrupt what happens here on earth and therefore can not intervene. However this goes against all religious documentation past down over time)

God is all powerful and all knowing but gave us free will to create the good and the bad and the ugly (This is simply the deal of our creation. Had the original sin not taken place, there would be no suffering and therefore it is all our fault anyway.)

There are many more theories. These are just a few of the major ones.

As for how this relates to adoption:
Some people with a strong sense of their own faith believe that every moment of their lives has been planned out by God. That whatever happens is what God wants for them, and that God teaches us lessons through many means, including trials and heart ache. This is called Predestination. So an example of this is
"God teaches me through infertility how to accept what I cannot change and teaches the pregnant woman something through her loss as well, such as "keep your legs closed before marriage."
They can justify all the pain in the world as a lesson of some sort.
I personally have a hard time with this mindset and I am a christian myself.
One of the most frustrating ideas for me is when I hear that God does something horrible, such as allowing me to be raped so I could help others. For Frick-sake! So then why did God allow the other person to be raped that I am now helping? So they could help the next victim???? So FRUSTRATING. It is not logical!

Nurse Autumn Intactivist NFP

LT, don't you get it? There is NO god! If there is one, then he doesn't seem like the kind of being that I want to worship, so he can go take a dose of his own medicine and go to hell.

Cool Hal

Hi LT

If you believe in all that - Gods record of looking after children is questionable to say the least.

Now I dont claim to be an expert but here are some of the facts and they are quite harsh.

1. He allowed his son to be murdered by some heathens
2. He whispered in Josephs ear that King Harold was going to kill all children under the age of two - why not whisper in every parents ear? Therefore saving a load of under twos - or smite the good old King with his smiting stick.
3. He killed a load under a flood only saving Noah grandchildren
4. He killed a load at Sodom
5. I am sure he did something nasty to the children of Egypt with sores and locus etc

They where his direct actions or things that he could have prevented.

His track record is not great and to be fair adoption whilst having some issues does sound a bit better than some of the above.

And before all my nasty emails start - If you are trying to save me you will be wasting your time. I will only read those that disprove the above. You will only be wasting your time.......

rachelrmf@sbcglobal.net

It really depends on if you believe in God or not. I do believe in God, But i personally feel he allowes us to choose are own paths in life. I don't think it is Gods will for a mother to give up her child, but i think God gave that mother the choice to do so and the strength for the mom to do what she felt she needed to at the time. As for the bad adoptions and foster care I don't know maybe God is judgeing our love if he gave us everything we ever wanted of coarse we would love him, but if he allows you to hurt and be abused and you still love him maybe that is how God finds out if its true love. Honestly you will need to see how you feel. If you think its cruel and God has nothing to do with it then I think thats just fine too. I really do wish the very best for you.

BLW_KAM

To those with deep spiritual views, God is everywhere. He's in the good, he's in the bad, he's in the indifferent. Since he is omnipotent and supreme, it only figures he has his hand in adoption.

I don't think anyone can explain why people hold religious views so tightly. It is unknown and unknowable.

I do not agree that religious people are less intelligent than others. They simply see the world through a different set of spectacles.

Jackie B

For some adoptees, the feel like God cheated them out of their family. For some others, they feel like God intervened to save them from a life that would otherwise not turn out so great. Infertile women feel like God led them to adoption to show them that infertility is not the end. B moms may feel God is punishing them for forcing their hand into placing their child for adoption while others believe God led them to a family who could give their baby what they know they cannot. I am a true believer in all things happen for a reason. All experiences, good and bad, make me who I am today.

Moses, anyone?

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