I was thinking...>?

DAR

Just call me 'conspiracy theorist'...

1. Bush is a globalist. He is the purest sort of capitalist that thinks the market should set everything. That includes wages, when there are those in this world who will take next to nothing to work by American standards and be glad to get it. Mexico has nothing on China in that regard, by the way.

In one form this leads to outsourcing. Being a patriotic sort of globalist, he wants to keep some companies here as well. Or if you are anti-Bush you might say that it is hard to 'outsource' construction of houses to another country and picking of strawberries, when the land the strawberries grow on is here. So he wants cheap labor here.

The problem is that long ago in this country we - not so much moved to socialism (unless you are listening to the ghost of my Grandfather) - as blunted capitalism. We believe workers need a minimum wage to have a decent life and we bought into the idea that that takes a level of subsidy in price hikes. That happened more than a generation ago, in the 'labor wars'. That's when unions started and we got a 'minimum wage'.

Part of the reasoning is that people paid a decent wage can keep their children in school and move into the middle class and start subsidizing services for others, who will then grow into the middle class... And so forth. This depends on keeping our education system functioning without being overstrained, however. This in turn requires more middle class to fund the system than there are poor who need subsidies for education.

Cheap labor through illegal immigration or a mass employer controlled 'guest worker program' ruins those gains for labor by driving down wages and straining education and services workers require for upward mobility.

Then is the tricky part, just to make sure I stick a conspiracy in here. Once the middle class is tapped out paying for all the new poor, and the wealthy reap the benefit of cheap labor, we ultimately end up with an upper crust and a huge lower class (similar to how people describe Mexico's economy). THEN we become 'ripe for revolution' in the Marxist sense. If you look at some of the organizers for the Marches, and go to their web pages, some were not socialists, but actual revolution-happy communists. For example: http://www.plp.org/

My supposition is that they hope either a) enough leftists will come in from socialist central and South America that they will push the US labor movement left, or b) there will be ultimate class differentiation until they have the revolution they want. I think they are a lot further from that than they hope, but listen to 'Enlightenment' on this board some time, carefully.

2. Bush and the heads of Canada and Mexico have working groups discussing a North American Alliance. There are all sorts of 'conspiracy theories' about what it is. However, the only official government statement I could find said we and Canada and Mexico were looking at free flow of goods and services and 'low risk traffic' [define that as you will.] Canada posts their working group member names on governmental web pages. Our government has said they don't want to give out the names because they don't want those people disturbed.

I think it is more globalism, a sort of 'Super NAFTA' at minimum. Congressman Tancredo has called for hearings to find out what is going on, so maybe we will find out.

There you are. Two conspiracy theories for the price of one!

tabbyjo27

hey thats good thinking, you might just be right

princess_29_71

Is this a different Pancha?

Love Exists?

Our economy depends on these illegal workers....if they stopped coming here and didnot work for such low wedges our companys would start sending bussiness over seas.....some of them are already sending there work to china,pakistan,india.....in other countries people work for less money and so do the illegal immigrants that come in from mexico.....i think Bush is just goin to make it harder for the immigrants to come in the us but i dont think Bush plans to stop it completly...most american factories especially construction department would go down the drain if the illegal immigrants stopped comin in and working for such low wedges...

ole_lady_93

Mexico is our Neighbors for Gods Sake. If you can't trust neighbors WHO can you trust. Think about it.
They are probly Just as feared as you are that some americans will come down there and kill them!!!!!

GTcasper

I agree with Aliana!!!

Boob

That is a horrible theory.

I say this because the border IS being secured, perhaps not as well is we would all like... but it is being secured.

isieasy7

I have that idea long time ago,(here is Pancha again)

ironhead041550

Yeah, I believe there could be a conspiracy there!!! Definitely!!!
Doesn't Pres. Bush prefer to expand his companies in other countries to keep from all of the big corporate hassle in the U.S.A??? I heard that he has agreed to build power plants in Mexico and ship the electricity to U.S.A??!! And to hire Mexican workers to man plant for less to save $$$. Pres. Bush is also using the illegal immigration issue to pull everyones concern away from his screw up in the Middle East.

Made_in_America

Excellent question and I do not believe that you are paranoid. You just might be on the right track with this one but are on the wrong track calling it a 'conspiracy theory'.

Lucky

You are on to something there. How much money do you think it takes to have your way with congress or a president? They are doing exactly what they have been asked to do.....NOTHING! Bought and paid for with the sweat of honest Americans slaving to make business interests in the US rich. No more health insurance; No more Retirement Plan; No more value in citizenship; Work until you die.

Mendi8a

sounds like paranoia, we cant blame Mexico, for what our presidents do or dont do.

hexa

Mexico is in one the conspiracy, that's why is lies to his people that they have rights here, and their stupid enough to believe it because their not educated, they believe he is telling the truth. it's a way for Bush to get cheap labor, and for Fox to get rid of his own poor people. that way he doesn't have to help them. He pushes them off on us. and we don't want them either.

hayleylov

lucky2bealive
hes right ! pancha i think its good to look at things and say why is this happening when clearly the majority wants our borders to be protected just like the majority wants illegal immigration to end and for no guest worker program and its like they are not hearing us i wonder why i think your on to something !

Sashie

Pancha, I'm ALWAYS worried when you start thinking ... :)

theboz

We didn't need to worry about the borders until we started pissing off the rest of the world. Your concerns about the border are simply a result of the guilt you feel for belonging to a nation that has done a lot of harm to others in recent history.

It is very telling of the self-centered American viewpoint that we get mad at the people who come here to escape our corporations invading their nations and ruining them. If our government were to keep our corporations in check, and if we were to reform the immigration laws, this issue simply would not exist.

It is pretty telling though that as Americans become more isolated as people, where parents are too paranoid to let their children play in the front yard with the neighbor's kids, we also want to cowardly hide behind walls like the communists did in Germany. It is a shame to see how far the people of this country have fallen.

Hadenough

If they did--look at both of them---Do they sound like men who would stick to their word unless it benefited them both? Or if people got tough with them personally, they would remain loyal to thier oath with each other?

I don't think that peace pipe with each other means anything.

But I do believe you are correct in that"all " the Governments want to connect into one( Mexico, America, Canada and South America as future goals. Including islands)

Mr. October

bush is Vicente Fox's bit*h

Stomp

Pancha, get in touch with BARBARA center; they will give you a link that may add insight to this. I don't have it handy, or I would post it here. Am on the road. You may be surprised.

sexxy cuban77

I dont understand you @ times. you first are upset because some express their opinion on not allowing illigal immigrants in the country, then all of a sudden you want to build a wall///who gets you

dn_reen

anything is possible. we are so concern about things that are so small to them but big to are eyes like, burning flags, hate towards cultures etc that we are being blinded to see the real truth of our precious government. that just sad to be living in a constitution of secrets.wealth and selfishness is what runs this country and other countries as well. but all leaders are corrupted no matter where they're from. they care for the people _ bull ****_ they care for the money.

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